Roan in the deep freeze
Salazar-Udall bill jeopardizes potential fiscal, energy windfalls
Rocky Mountain News
Published April 22, 2008 at 12:05 a.m.
Like it or not, the clock may run out before energy companies gain access to the massive natural gas supplies beneath federal lands on the Roan Plateau.
Unfortunately, the proposal introduced Thursday by Democratic Sen. Ken Salazar and Reps. John Salazar and Mark Udall would place new development on the Roan on hold. It would jeopardize a financial bonanza for the state that could reach $1 billion.
At this point, delaying new development may be the same as denying it. Whether the next president is Hillary Clinton, John McCain or Barack Obama, domestic fossil-fuel production is likely to have a lower priority than it has under President Bush. And in the case of Clinton and Obama, probably much lower.
Regulators could impose procedural delays that make drilling financially unattractive to energy companies. Investors who have no guarantee where, whether or how soon they can drill on the Roan are likely to sink their capital in locations that are more welcoming to energy production.
In theory, the bill would enact the outline for the Roan offered by Gov. Bill Ritter in December, for which we had kind words. In fact, though, it would impose many more restrictions. It could place much of the estimated 9 trillion cubic feet of natural gas beneath federally controlled areas of the Roan out of reach.
Not only could that gas heat every home in Colorado for 20 years; leases and royalties from the wells could also secure essential funding for impacted communities and higher education. That money won't materialize if drilling isn't economically viable.
Ritter made it clear in December that he wanted to avoid modifying the Bureau of Land Management's "records of decision," or regulatory blueprints for the Roan. That process took seven years, and any new review could go on interminably.
We've always believed that the BLM's plan was a sound proposal to extract the Roan's bounty while causing negligible environmental damage.
The bad news is the Salazar-Udall bill would put development in the deep freeze. For instance, the bill mandates where leases will be issued first: either the Anvil Ridge or Corral Ridge regions of the Roan. No other area can be leased until 99 percent of the land in the previous drilling area had been restored to its "pre-disturbance" state.
While Rep. Salazar said Thursday that Anvil Ridge and Corral Ridge are the least environmentally sensitive regions on the Roan, what if gas resources there are difficult to tap, or not as productive as in other areas?
Under the BLM's phased development plan, energy companies could decide where to drill first. No more than 350 surface acres could be disturbed at a time (that limit is in the bill, too) but companies could initially target the most-promising sites.
Next, the Salazar-Udall bill would require the Interior Department to allow public comment before any leases are issued after Anvil Ridge and Corral Ridge. That could hold up leasing for years. The BLM opened its public comments for the Roan plan in November 2004; the initial record of decision became final in June 2007.
Finally, the state Department of Natural Resources must approve new drilling areas after Anvil Ridge and Corral Ridge are developed. In other words, state environmental officials could veto energy production on federal land, where the state typically has no jurisdiction.
The Salazar-Udall bill would place both energy production and any financial windfall from the Roan at risk. It's a stalling tactic. Drilling should have started long ago. Let the leasing begin.
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April 22, 2008
4:23 a.m.
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windbourne writes:
Amazing. pubs want to drill all over, but they just do not want to be forced to drill in a clean responsible fashion. For all the whining that I hear from this editorial, perhaps it is time to think in terms of a COMPROMISE. The simple fact is, that drilling in environmentally sensitive areas should be allowed, but SHOULD require that more attention be paid to it. IN particular, it SHOULD require that more money be spent to protect it. To the editor who wrote this, you would turn this state into Texas. Thank you, NO!
Hopefully this will change things.
April 22, 2008
6:50 a.m.
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Mike_In_Hartsel writes:
Folks, we are the top of the food chain. Either we get more energy or we stop reproducing. The Denocrats and tree huggers don't want either. Why are you crying? These are our ELECTED representatives selling us out! You get what you voted for.
April 22, 2008
6:55 a.m.
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dukeco1 writes:
The numbers you use claiming vast resources of gas and a billion dollars of revenue from the Roan are numbers cooked up by the AAE. Hardly an objective source of information, the Americans for American Energy group is headed by Greg Schnacke, a militant, former head of the Colorado Oil and Gas Association. If you believe the information you get from those folks, you are unbelievably naive.
The people who live in the vicinity of the Roan overwhelmingly don't want ANY drilling on public land on top of the Roan plateau. None. Zip. Zilch. The claim that this incredibly sensitive landscape will be protected by this industry under any development scenario is something I simply do not believe. I live here. I have witnessed the devastation wrought on other parts of our local landscape and see nothing in the industrys' proposals that would afford adequate protection for the "unique and irreplacable"(BLM, 2002) watersheds up there. ( that 1% at a time ploy is a joke )
If the companies that want to drill up there aren't willing to commit to the most stringent safeguards in the history of gas drilling, then let them go somewhere else to make a few million dollars in profit. National security, shortages of resource, or consumer prices are not relevant issues here. They are merely exmples of the misinformation commonly used by the AAE and others of their ilk to maneuver their way into an area that should be protected. If the initiatives of Senator Salazar and Congressmen Salazar and Udall cause the industry to abandon plans to drill the Roan, you will hear the cheers of locals all the way to the office of whoever wrote this misguided opinion in the Rocky.
April 22, 2008
7:34 a.m.
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greenleaf writes:
We need to reduce our need for energy through conservation. To conserve natural gas, everyone needs to consider available technology: efficient furnaces, set-back thermostats, more insulation for walls and attics and better windows. Doing the right thing could save huge amounts of natural gas and save a lot of money as well. We should consider efficiencies and alternatives before we trash more of our beautiful scenery and wildlife habitat .
Happy Earth Day Earl and SASQUATCH and everybody!
April 22, 2008
8:01 a.m.
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greenleaf writes:
Happy Earth day to you too Gene!
What do you mean? Jimmy and I are still wearing sweaters. I hear they're the new "hot" thing in the fashion and environmental world this year. Want to hoist a latifolia neat later?
April 22, 2008
8:40 a.m.
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greenleaf writes:
Happy Earth Day Squatch,
How ironic that you bring up your "look out the window test" on such a warm, dry spring day. Usually you deploy your infallible "test" on a cold winter day as "proof" that Global warming doesn't exist, but you only end up proving that your logic doesn't exist.
You are pointing out the same lack of logic by saying that there exist "endless" supplies of natural gas and that "Everywhere you poke a hole in North America, NG spews out.". I guess that's why we have such a raging controversy in Colorado where thousands of wells are being drilled so as to pipe it off to other parts of North America that don't have natural gas.
We don't have to sacrifice everything for fossil fuels. We can conserve and explore alternatives before we trash the rest of Colorado for the sake of short term profits for the gas industry.
Rather than being one of the finest minds of the 19th century when you were ahead of your time Squatch, why don't you join with those of us who are working toward solutions for today's energy problems. Its time to begin moving beyond the carbon economy.
April 22, 2008
9:14 a.m.
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davis_x_machina writes:
Thanks to earl for once more providing proof that wingnuts are so wed to the past they're probably still mourning the passing of the buggy whip industry.Anyone that only views solar and wind turbines as a replacement component in our present system of centralized energy production and distribution has never investigated producing what you need where you need it and selling the excess back to the big producers on the grid.Earl needs to look at Jay Leno's 17,000 sq. ft. auto shop- where he indulges his rich mans hobby of restoring Deusenbergs and other classic cars and is completely powered by a combination of vertical axis wind generators and photovoltaic panels.Your buddy bigfoot would seem to be possessed of the same degree and quality of logic.
April 22, 2008
9:21 a.m.
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soccermom writes:
I am disappointed that the Rocky Mountain News has used Earth Day to push for drilling in such a biologically diverse area. The recent major spills that occurred in the past few months in the area west of the Roan Plateau prove that not all spills are reported and that they occur more often than the extractive industry would like to admit.
Petroglyph Energy and the Colorado Oil and Gas Conservation Commission are still trying to determine how methane gas got into resident water wells (Huerfano County) Accidents occur and accidents in such environmentally rich areas will be harder to restore. Actually, have you ever tried to recreate an ecosystem? It's darn near impossible to restore the necessary fragile web of nutrients, microbes and other biota that make up these habitats.
Responsible drilling can occur in other areas of the state that have infrastructure in place. It is more logical to have drilling closer to urban areas rather than have pristine habitats fragmented by roads and drill pads. If you negotiate away 50% wilderness this time, then next time 50% of that, and keep going until you are left with 50% of 0.01% well then just what do we have left?
Call me any name you like, (and conservationists are called a lot of not very nice things) but I believe it is time to stop these scare tactics and really start to work on this nation's problems. And a lot of these problems have started or gotten worse under this Administration. As I said in an earlier post last week, the next president will not have a fire sale of our natural resources and the extractive industries are doing their best to lock in their interests now.
Let the leasing begin? Shame on you Rocky Mountain News, you are undermining the efforts of the Colorado Oil and Gas Conservation Commission, Gov. Ritter, industry, landowners, residents, local governments, recreationists, hunters, anglers, tourists, conservationists and all the others that are working together to put sound drilling procedures in place.
Thank goodness that Ken Salazar and Mark Udall are listening to their constituents!
April 22, 2008
9:36 a.m.
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westsloper333 writes:
I agree with Duke. I live at the foot of the Roan and we, the locals that have seen our communities ripped-up by industry don't want any more drilling. If drilling must go on - it must be done with significant safegaurds for environmental and human health. Additionally - the "millions" of dollars to impacted communities wouldn't be needed if our community wasn't impacted by drilling (besides - our community doesn't get back what is needed to combat the impacts anyway). The Rocky really missed the mark on this one.
April 22, 2008
9:41 a.m.
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greenleaf writes:
Squatch,
Thanks for reinforcing my point regarding your lack of logic and dated thought processes. It seems that you are determined to keep your 19th and early 20th century mindset well into this one. As I've said before: you can lead a hairy, mythological beast like a Sasquatch to logic but you can't make him think!
April 22, 2008
9:43 a.m.
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greenleaf writes:
soccermom, davis, westsloper,
Happy Earth Day!
April 22, 2008
9:57 a.m.
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greenleaf writes:
Squatch,
Suddenly, I understand why you think the way you do! You attend all these festivals don't you? Just out of curiosity, what "brain-fry cocktail" did you bring to the festivities?
One more thing_ I don't know where you do your shopping old scratch, but you can buy all that stuff for a lot less than you are paying! Wow, they must see you coming! I'm worried about you buddy, you don't live alone do you?
April 22, 2008
10:02 a.m.
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westsloper333 writes:
squatch - I produce much of my food in my backyard and share with my neighbors and co-workers. I live close to work and shopping on purposee and ride my bike as muc as I can. I buy 2 tanks of gas a month at most. my thermostat is set at 59 degrees in the winter and 79 in the summer. I reuse "trash" as much as I can since recycling is limited where I live. Not because i'm a greenie (far from it)...but becuase it makes economic sense to me and much of what I do I learned from my grand parents (who lived thru the depression). Why insult and attack others just becuase they think and live differently than you do?
April 22, 2008
10:13 a.m.
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dukeco1 writes:
By the way, Mr. big, hairy, mythological creature; BLOW is used to refer to cocaine, not marijuana.
April 22, 2008
10:26 a.m.
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greenleaf writes:
Squatch,
Congratulations buddy, I see that you finally found a long lost relative! Maybe they can help you with your shopping problems!
Happy Earth Day!
April 22, 2008
11:08 a.m.
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sunshinestate writes:
Colorado and it's state's hunters, many who have historically supported Republican admimistrations, will be better served by a pause and a new administration.Interesting to see this month's Field & Stream warning of the Bush administration push.
This editorial is sad.I feel lucky I live in the "Sunshine State"(Florida)
April 22, 2008
11:19 a.m.
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MGD writes:
Hey Sasquatch, is this you by any chance?
http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?...
The problem with allowing big oil companies to come drill in the Roan, even if they agree to do it responsibly, is that their track record is terrible. If they could do it and maintain the natural environment then I would be all for it but they have a huge impact on any area that they drill. I know it would cut into their record profits but they have the technology to do it right.
Solar on your house is smart for a lot of reasons. Alternative transportation is smart for a lot of reasons.
So many big oil fans are big money fans. I'll put this in investment terms so that the message will reach you. We have most of our eggs in one basket. We are not diversified in terms of energy development and production. Diversification insulates us from things like demand spikes for oil or war in oil producing companies. We are skilled at getting energy from oil and coal, we need to diversify which is not to say we can get away from fossile fuels, we just need to have alternatives.
Wouldn't it be nice not to have our economy impacted so much by the decisions that OPEC makes?
April 22, 2008
11:47 a.m.
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mytwosense writes:
The only recipients of any "financial bonanza" will be the oil companies and the politicians they bought and paid for. The losers will be the citizens of Colorado, as their state increasingly becomes a wasteland.
The last eight years are a clear demonstration of this lesson, which apparently some of you didn't learn.
We've had a former oil exec as our President. And a former oil exec as our Vice President.
Unless you hold major stock in the oil companies, I doubt you've reaped any kind of financial bonanza as a result of their energy policies. On the other hand, you've likely paid out a financial bonanza in gas and utility bills.
Thank you Udall, for being one of the few politicians left who won't sell Coloradoans out to the highest bidders!
April 22, 2008
12:20 p.m.
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soccermom writes:
Let's not forget our own former Gov. Owens, who left office and became a Director on the Board of Key Energy Services, Inc. an oil well service and equipment industry based out of Houston, Texas. Their Rocky Mt. interests include the Four Corners Region, the Denver-Julesberg Basin, etc.
Bob Schaffer who is running for Senator Allard's seat has his own oil interests and has a 0 out of a 100 ranking with the League of Conservation Voters.
The smart energy companies have already seen the light and are diversifying. They're in the business to make money and they know where the action is going to be. Welcome to the Green Era.
April 22, 2008
12:20 p.m.
Suggest removal
p_myers661 writes:
soccermom, davis, westsloper, and greenleaf
The need for the natural gas on the Roan is real. It is now and those who offer alternatives are dreamers. What are the costs of those alternative measures? Are they practical? Dreaming about the various possibilities is a great hobby. It just doesn't work as an occupation. The cost for insulation can be justified by the benefit it gives. The cost for energy efficient appliances can be computed over time to determine if the benefit will be great enough to justify the costs. The cost for solar panels, wind turbines and other "renewables" is high. The benefit they grant is not stable. It depends on weather conditions. Sunshine and wind exist but cannot be predicted. Most of the time, the return time for a benefit from these investments can be ten or twenty years if conditions are favorable. There must be a backup power source too. The backup is either coal fired, NG fired or nuclear power plants. Most cannot afford this level of improvement because they don't have enough income to pay double the value of their house for such an experiment.
The Roan represents a source of energy in a form that we can access with current technology, a source that has been approved for drilling and is a source that can be in use in a relatively short time. Much of the moaning and whining here is the "what if they don't honor the contract provisions for cleanup and restoration." The name of the game is profit and putting the drilling area back to a pristine condition is required if they want to keep drilling. The first well requires a heavy investment in equipment relocation and personnel training/moving. The second and other wells benefit from that investment. The cost of restoration is about a third or less than the initial "setup" costs for drilling. To fail in the restoration would be the same as throwing money away. Not going to happen.
The state can benefit from the tax revenues. Maybe they can be allocated to upgrade low income homes to a higher energy standard. They represent a great benefit to our state and its people only if we permit it to be developed. When the development begins there will be demonstrations, protests and a lot of upset. When they actually start drilling the news outlets that want to visit the area on future Earth Days will need a map to find the site while they are drilling because the area is so large and the areas impacted are so small. After restoration they will need a GPS. Look at current wells for the former and old wells for the latter.
Celebrate Earth Day by helping humankind. We are the only creatures on the planet who care about it. Other animals and plants just go ahead and use what they need and leave the mess.
April 22, 2008
12:22 p.m.
Suggest removal
RickyLee writes:
A "financial bonanza" for the greedy politicoes to waste. Oh goody.
April 22, 2008
12:40 p.m.
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ollie writes:
"let the leasing begin", or did you mean let the raping begin?
April 22, 2008
12:44 p.m.
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MGD writes:
P_Myers,
Do you think that drilling in the Roan will have an impact on our fossile fuel costs? What percentage of world-wide production would it represent?
Have the oil companies done a good job of restoration so far? My personal experince is that they have not and yet they still make massive profits, therefore I don't buy your argument that restoration is a priority. If drilling started today, when would the Roan be returned, as you say, to pristine condition?
Finally, where do you get "double the value of their house" for alternative energy costs? A friend just installed solar on his for around $12000. Yes, that was a chunk and yes it will take time for his investment to pay off. Fortunately, that is not that only consideration. His is set up to basically negate the annual cost of electricity. He sells his overage back to the utility company when he has it and buys some power when he needs it. It was engineered to be a wash in terms of money spent annually on electricity. The bigger picture is that he is using far less coal powered electricity than most of the rest of us.
The $12000 investment represents about 4% of what I estimate his home to be worth prior to the installation. I would guess that the solar adds some value as well.
April 22, 2008
12:46 p.m.
Suggest removal
mytwosense writes:
p_myers: " The cost for solar panels, wind turbines and other "renewables" is high. The benefit they grant is not stable. It depends on weather conditions. Sunshine and wind exist but cannot be predicted."
Actually, Colorado is an incredibly ideal state for solar energy. We're one of the sunniest states in the US! Also, solar *storage* technology is advancing. You should, even just out of idle curiosity, research the subject sometime, as it's certainly an important consideration for less sunny climates.
p_myers: "Most of the time, the return time for a benefit from these investments can be ten or twenty years if conditions are favorable. There must be a backup power source too. The backup is either coal fired, NG fired or nuclear power plants. Most cannot afford this level of improvement because they don't have enough income to pay double the value of their house for such an experiment."
Right now, your average commercial business can get a return on installing a solar system within two years. As more and more commercial businesses go solar, the more energy XCEL will have to buy back and re-sell to residential customers. In other words, supply will increase, which *should* lower the cost of the product.
For a residential customer, the return on solar is probably about seven years. And let's not forget that for both residential and commercial customers, electricity bills become almost zero.
That being said, a complete installation for a residence can cost a lot, and you're right, a good deal of us don't have that money lying around. I know I don't. BUT, you can also go solar in segments - from installing sun pipe lighting (which can be less than $500 and includes both installation and materials) to installing a solar hot water heating system, which will certainly slash your utility bills.
So you can save in the interim as prices on installations go down. And they will go down, because demand is only going to increase. It sounds like a marketing slogan, but as another poster stated, it really is the Green Era.
I think it's inevitable. If you look over the entire history of our energy usage, the trend has always been to advance sustainability. Heck, the discovery that oil could heat our homes saved us from cutting down all our trees instead.
But, we're advancing even past oil and natural gas now, with a mind for continued preservation of our planet. It's the natural progression of things, and a positive one at that.
April 22, 2008
12:48 p.m.
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mytwosense writes:
p_myers: "The state can benefit from the tax revenues. Maybe they can be allocated to upgrade low income homes to a higher energy standard."
Do you know if they do that now with the tax revenue they get from natural gas production in Colorado? If they don't, they should. Also, if they don't already do this (I honestly don't know), how likely is it they will if they increase production somewhere else?
April 22, 2008
1:14 p.m.
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MGD writes:
Okay, I just re-read your post and don't know why I missed the humor in this the first time.
P_Myers:"Other animals and plants just go ahead and use what they need and leave the mess."
Are you serious? Yeah, I know that deer poop and they just don't clean it up. I saw an elk pee once, right on the trail!! And then the leaves that the tree in my front yard dropped really put me over the edge. You are right, the animals and plants are ruining this planet.
You are clearly a shill for the oil and pollution industry. Anti plant and animal to boot? Wow, I am at a loss. I don't want to resort to further name calling so this post is done.
April 22, 2008
1:22 p.m.
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mytwosense writes:
Gene, actually, my professional life has led me of late to a closer study of solar power. I am not just yammering this stuff out because it feels good to say.
Although it DOES feel good to know the era of alternative energy is finally here. For one thing, I strongly believe it's our ticket out of an endless cycle of war over finite, dwindling resources. That's what all war is about, whether anyone wants to admit it or not.
Second, I think alternative energy can stem the tide towards mass globalization of the economy. Alternative energy works very well in a less centralized economic model, where we produce more of what we use closer to where we live. It's true that oil has made mass transit of consumer goods from faraway places possible, and to be honest, up until a few years ago, I thought this was a good thing.
Now I see that some of the effects of this mass materialism are decidedly negative. Everything revolves around "growth, the economy, the marketplace" now. If it's there, take it. Buy it. Sell it. But whatever you do, don't even think about "making" whatever it is you want. That would require time and concentration - and who has either these days? We're too busy on the hamster wheel of making more money so we can...buy more stuff.
April 22, 2008
1:30 p.m.
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RainbowWarrior writes:
We need to develop a show case of technology and ideas that is available for the education of many of the poorly informed and ignorant people posting out right lies and misinformation in forums like this.
Rather than a Parade of Homes every year for the rich and famous and their 10,000 square foot Mac Mansions for 2, how about showing some of the homes around Colorado that use alternatives and their owners live in with little or no expense?
We need to establish a way to lead by example and share the progress made so some of the fringe that post the same lies and rant about the same failed idiology day after day after day just fades away into the dust of their old failed life styles.
We are a free people and should stay that way. Live and let live. Let the die hards cling to their ways as the rest of us with good ideas and intentions lead the way by actions and deeds, as they will always speak louder than writen or spoken words.
Let's show them how it's done, and how easy and affordable it is.
With the popularity of reality TV these days, what is everyone afraid of? The embarasment of finding out they have been living and promoting a lie at the expense of everyone else's future?
I call for a competetion, and a wager! A green team against the old school; solar vs. coal, wind vs. nucs, straw vs. stick, clay vs. brick...
Winners take all, looser live with the results!
April 22, 2008
1:43 p.m.
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mytwosense writes:
RainbowWarrior: "Rather than a Parade of Homes every year for the rich and famous and their 10,000 square foot Mac Mansions for 2, how about showing some of the homes around Colorado that use alternatives and their owners live in with little or no expense?"
That is a brilliant idea! May I suggest you follow it up by writing to the Colorado Solar Energy Industries Association and seeing if this is something they would help you advance? I imagine they would be an excellent resource to have on board and might have some ideas on how you could push this forward. http://www.coseia.org/
April 22, 2008
2:03 p.m.
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mytwosense writes:
earl: "btw I use hot water heat[powered by a very old early 80's solar panel, in my house when I am not using the fireplace."
Cool! Can we include your house in the new "Solar Parade of Homes"? :)
April 22, 2008
2:07 p.m.
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MGD writes:
Earl, I suspect that Greenleaf does practice an environmentally protective lifestyle based on many of his posts.
Actually, straw bale houses are very old school. There are still a bunch of them in Nebraska that are over 100 years old and they still insultate better than most new homes. They are old school and are re-emerging.
Early, with your fireplace in a straw bale house you would not need another heat source. A few more solar panels and you could go off-grid, if your local building ordinance allows that.
April 22, 2008
2:37 p.m.
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tmsloan writes:
I suggest we just let Global Warming happen unchecked. We would burn less fuel to heat our homes, spew less polution, have cleaner air, and have lower heating bills. In addition we wouldn't have to drill on the Roan or Alaska and the environmentalist would get everything they want except they wouldn't be able to control the weather or the economy.
GO GLOBAL WARMING!!!
April 22, 2008
4:17 p.m.
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p_myers661 writes:
MGD
The example of the animals was to show that humans do care about the planet even though the various groups fight like tigers about some things.
If you really want to make an difference in the oil business, design a car that doesn't use oil. In 1969 I was a student at the Colorado School of Mines and we had a HCL pressure conversion that would run a car on a 9 volt battery. Back then the technology to control the reaction and contain the components cost three times what a gasoline powered car would cost. That will become practical as oil increases in price.
At one time, we were dependent upon whale oil for lubrication in industry as well as for oil lamps. Petroleum changed that and destroyed a major portion of the whaling industry.
Solar power depends on solar cells. Technology will bring costs down. There is a "tipping point" where the cost will be low enough in relation to other options and it will be part of the natural order to use solar. Wind power is a bit more difficult to improve, but gearing and the use of universal joints to multiply the power will do the same for wind.
I have seen oil companies on site and, while they are drilling there is a lot of technology and people on a site. Once the well is achieved there is less than a traffic control box worth of difference in the area. A well head is there and the controls to monitor it. The area is re-seeded after any "tire tracks" are filled in. Mining for minerals can cause a lot more damage. There are numerous reclaimed mines where you have to be told the mine was there. Some will post a picture of a 1950's mining site or one that is in process and use that as an example of what is happening now. That's like saying 1950's cars are the same as 2008 cars.
Technology creates progress.
In Colorado the cost of natural gas is regulated by the PUC. One of the components of a cost is transportation costs. The price of natural gas Xcel pays would be reduced because the cost of the gas would be lower and the cost of transport would be lower. Together that means the people of Colorado will benefit.
As for government "spending wisely", I only know that part of the funding for LEAP and the HEATHELP programs comes from the state budget. Last year, and this, according to a totally unprofessional source, year the state found extra money in the budget and sent it to those programs. It would be a simple thing to "earmark" a portion of the severance taxes for such things.
Ten years in a convent, twelve years in a taxi and ten years in a semi truck give me a unique perspective. You and greenleaf appear to be ordinary, sensible people. I disagree with some of your opinions and your definitions. Most people can agree to disagree and work on the common good areas.
For the present we need oil and natural gas. In the future we will have other options. . Be well and keep on posting. You're people with a sense of humor and intelligent ideas.
April 22, 2008
4:58 p.m.
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greenleaf writes:
Happy earth day again everybody!
I've spent my entire professional day outside planting and cleaning up in my environmental landscape design business. I know it sounds contrived, but its true, that's what I do! I'm excited to see so many comments about the Roan and the environment.
P._Meyers, I would rather have the dream of a green energy future than to continue on our current path. As a native Coloradoan and outdoorsman, I have seen Oil and Gas clean ups when wells are capped and abandoned. I think they have gotten better, true enough, but I have yet to see one that has dealt well with all aspects of restoration. Heavy equipment compacts the soil along access roads and at the pad site. Chemical spills are common and often move to ground water before anyone discovers them. Re-vegetation consists mostly of sowing a mix of grasses and perennials for rapid cover and erosion control. If trees and shrubs are planted to replace those that have been bulldozed, they are small and will take years to reach the size of those destroyed assuming they don't die first in the non-irrigated, compacted soils. Invasive plant species are often introduced as well by the soil disturbance and human activity. Roads are often kept open after " abandonment" by off-roaders and hunters. My perception is that a better job of reclamation is being done but it could still be better.
As for solar power, I installed a system on my roof that supplies 80% of my needs. Had I paid for the total system, it would have cost 26 grand. Instead, by partnering with Xcel I actually paid 13 grand or about 3% of my house's value. Where did you get the idea that it would cost 30 X that much?
When Prius comes out with a plug in option, I intend to add more panels to my house to supply the car. I will probably keep my old Prius for days when the sun "don't shine".
All of us know that oil,coal and gas will be with us far into the future, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't dream and take steps toward a better cleaner energy world.
Happy Earth Day my friend!
April 22, 2008
5:05 p.m.
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greenleaf writes:
mytwosense, rainbow warrior,
For several years in the spring, the National Renewable Energy Laboratory in Golden has offered just such a program, The day starts in Golden, where you visit displays and receive maps to open houses which display everything from Earl's solar hot water heat to houses that have computer control features that open and close blinds and monitor energy consumption and output. Check their website to see when the tour is scheduled. Its great fun!
April 22, 2008
5:26 p.m.
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greenleaf writes:
Earl,
Every day since 1870 has been Earth Day for me. I have been responsible in my career for scores of environmental landscape designs. I have planted or directed the planting of more trees and shrubs than most people would in a hundred lifetimes. I have also moved my customers, friends and relatives and anyone who would listen away from chemical based landscape maintenance. I have saved my customers thousands of dollars in water, energy, fertilizer and chemical expenses, and probably saved thousands of birds and beneficial organisms as a result.
I have installed a wildlife habitat of my own design and approved by the Colorado Division of Wildlife at my kid's school.
I reduced, reused, recycled and composted at least a decade before it even occurred to most people to do so. My yard has almost no grass; but has a beautiful xeriscape and a large organic vegetable, herb and small fruit garden. I too, had a solar hot water system until it died a very messy death a couple of years ago. I haven't replaced it yet. I do however, have solar collectors on my roof and a Prius in the garage. I have at least 10 other energy conserving projects planned for my house in the next few years.
So, yes Earl, I do celebrate Earth Day 365 days a year. I do so, in part, because so many don't celebrate it at all.
I'm glad you have solar hot water Earl, I'm pleasantly surprised. I bet it was like mine and as SASQUATCH might say "is one of those recycled ideas from the Jimmy Carter Era"!
A sincere Happy Earth Day to you Earl, may we both live to see many more!
April 22, 2008
8:26 p.m.
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greenleaf writes:
Gene,
I think I started my latifolias waaaaaaay too early tonight! Gosh, in 1870 I was only a teenager:>)!
I think SASQUATCH is a lot older than that, I think he goes back at least to the dark ages, and I DO mean the DARK ages!
I wish that mistake had leapt out at me. It may take a while to live this one down.
Later buddy!
April 22, 2008
9:02 p.m.
Suggest removal
p_myers661 writes:
greenleaf
The figure comes from an attempt, when I bought my mother's house from her, to add solar and a tankless water heater. The cost was so high it was out of the question. No problem with wanting it. Problem was with paying for such a high investment with 1984 technology. That's where the figures came from. Paid her 78K for the house. I know the layered solar cell has been upgraded to a better type but no details. We insu;ate inside the outlets and have a special layer under our mobile home to insulate the floor. At my mother's, we had insulated the walls, installed double pane windows and used a double layer patio door system to keep the heat in. Thermostat is set at 74 in the summer and 65 in the winter. (My father was in the heating/cooling industry.) There was very little entergy use in that house. If, when we bought our home, (Only bought the house for Mom to give it back to her after I cleared the mortgage.)I'd still been earning what I made as a cab driver, or even a truck driver, we'd have investigated solar and the tankless hot water systems. We just barely clear the mortgage payment along with the lot rent each month. When I die, the insurance will pay for those changes as well as buy a piece of land where the trailer can be set up so the lot rent payment will go away. The loan payment on the land won't even be half of the current lot rent.
I'm a believer in tipping points. Once there is an alternative to oil for power and gas for energy, the situation will change. Free market investors and innovators will get involved and we will have a change. Solar driveway lights are becoming so common that they sell them in King Soopers. I estimate that, within ten years, solar heat panels and solar hot water heaters will be common item at Home Depot. Most people will make the change gradually. I do wonder what Xcel will do about it.
The clean up on the Roan is guaranteed by the profit motive. If they want to keep drilling, they have to clean up the other areas first.
Your concerns are real but I saw a plow used all around one drill site to deal with that. Young trees would be the result. That gives us a chance to replace trees dying from disease and insects with those strong enough to survive.
My garden is larger than my mother's. I will have a full herb garden as well as a dozen plum tomatoes, two dozen squash plants and twenty five pepper plants. Granddaughter chose to plant carrots, sweet potatoes and peas. Last year I spent most of the summer in and out of the hospital...no garden.
April 22, 2008
10:18 p.m.
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greenleaf writes:
p_meyers,
I understand now. A different time, less developed technology and a lower base price for the house. I'm impressed that you would consider this back in 1984. You were way ahead of the curve! I noticed your mention of temperature settings. I find it fascinating to analyse individual comfort levels and perceptions. My wife recently visited an old high school friend in Wisconsin. The first thing my wife noticed was how warm their house was. She asked what the temperature was and was told that they keep their nearly 5000 square foot house at 75 degrees. We have a set back thermostat. During the day we have it set at 59 degrees. at night when we are in bed, it drops to 52 degrees. We think it's great and simply dress warmly and have a down comforter at night. Other folks are shocked! I'm convinced its good for us too as neither of us has had a cold in years. In the summer, we use a fan and don't have air conditioning.
As for the extraction industry in Colorado, I look at recent failures in containment ponds. At least one wasn't reported, but fortunately was found by inspectors. I know that people take short cuts in many fields of endeavour, but most of those don't have the same potential for damage to health and wildlife that the oil and gas industries do. I hope you are right, but I've been around and seen too much not to be skeptical.
Its always good to garden, it's one of the few things an inner city dweller can share with suburbanites and farmers. Its also one of the few things in the modern world that ties us to the earth. My family have farmed in this country for 10 generations, I'm the first to leave the farm, but its " in my blood" as they say!
I hope you have a productive garden this year and no hail!
April 23, 2008
1:35 p.m.
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dmortek writes:
Brilliant! Gas is $3.40 a gallon so let's make it harder and more expensive to get the crude oil and gas! Only politicians and treehuggers can see that logic. And then they blame everyone else for the problem!
April 23, 2008
2:25 p.m.
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mytwosense writes:
dmortek, we already have a sizable amount of domestic drilling in the US, both on and offshore. A lot of that is exported into the global markets, where the highest bidder wins. Even if we opened up drilling in other places, that's not going to result in lower prices for the US, not by a long shot.
We're dealing with a finite, dwindling supply and an ever increasing demand for it. Don't you think it's a sensible idea to at least add some alternatives into the mix?